Hello electronic wizards.
I apologize if someone has already asked this question. I did a half ass search
and didn't find an answer. The rig I just purchased just had new house batteries
installed. When the rig is plugged into 120v the batteries show that they are
at 13 volts. When I unplug the 120v power and start the rig the house batteries
show 12 volts while the engine battery shows 14 volts from the alternator.
I keep seeing something about some type of thing behind the drivers seat.
Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, Steve.
Battery charging
Re: Battery charging
If you are waiting for a wizard, it may take some time. You can get started with someone much less ideal, however.
I guess you are referring to the battery separator (solenoid) that connect the start battery to the coach batteries? If it is a two way version, when the start battery is fully charged, it will start to charge your house batteries. But I kind of not sure if the one that most of us have is the one way version.... maybe someone else can confirm, but if that is the case, then you can only get your coach batteries charged by the converter/charger.
You can take a look at the Reference section, and take a look at the Surepoower device (viewtopic.php?f=6&t=434) manual and see how it works.
The separator is under the hood on the driver side in my 2000 Concourse... what year is yours? Anyway the device behind the driver seat is the LVD, and there is a manual in the Reference section too. It is to protect your batteries from being overdrawn.
Now if you are worry about the 12 volt reading of the battery when you are not charging it from shore power, maybe the coach batteries needs to be checked. How old are they? Did you try to bring them to a battery shop to have them charge and load test them?
I am new to this, so I will be learning with you. One of my acid batteries is not hold charge too well either.
I guess you are referring to the battery separator (solenoid) that connect the start battery to the coach batteries? If it is a two way version, when the start battery is fully charged, it will start to charge your house batteries. But I kind of not sure if the one that most of us have is the one way version.... maybe someone else can confirm, but if that is the case, then you can only get your coach batteries charged by the converter/charger.
You can take a look at the Reference section, and take a look at the Surepoower device (viewtopic.php?f=6&t=434) manual and see how it works.
The separator is under the hood on the driver side in my 2000 Concourse... what year is yours? Anyway the device behind the driver seat is the LVD, and there is a manual in the Reference section too. It is to protect your batteries from being overdrawn.
Now if you are worry about the 12 volt reading of the battery when you are not charging it from shore power, maybe the coach batteries needs to be checked. How old are they? Did you try to bring them to a battery shop to have them charge and load test them?
I am new to this, so I will be learning with you. One of my acid batteries is not hold charge too well either.
2000 Concourse dinette, on 1999 6.8L Ford E350 Triton V-10 Chassis
Re: Battery charging
The coach batteries are brand new. I would think that if the engine battery was readingchin_k wrote: August 6th, 2020, 7:34 pm If you are waiting for a wizard, it may take some time. You can get started with someone much less ideal, however.
I guess you are referring to the battery separator (solenoid) that connect the start battery to the coach batteries? If it is a two way version, when the start battery is fully charged, it will start to charge your house batteries. But I kind of not sure if the one that most of us have is the one way version.... maybe someone else can confirm, but if that is the case, then you can only get your coach batteries charged by the converter/charger.
You can take a look at the Reference section, and take a look at the Surepoower device (viewtopic.php?f=6&t=434) manual and see how it works.
The separator is under the hood on the driver side in my 2000 Concourse... what year is yours? Anyway the device behind the driver seat is the LVD, and there is a manual in the Reference section too. It is to protect your batteries from being overdrawn.
Now if you are worry about the 12 volt reading of the battery when you are not charging it from shore power, maybe the coach batteries needs to be checked. How old are they? Did you try to bring them to a battery shop to have them charge and load test them?
I am new to this, so I will be learning with you. One of my acid batteries is not hold charge too well either.
14 volts while the rig is running then the house batteries should show the same voltage
if they are being charged by the alternator?
Re: Battery charging
I see what you are looking for. I missed the part where you said you have new coach batteries. Sorry about that.
For my rig, the separator is a Surepower 1315, so it is bi-directional. It will connect the batteries (start/coach) if either one of them is above 13.2 volt. So if you measure 14 volts at the separator start battery terminals, then it should be connected to the coach batteries and start charging them too.
Again, what type of rig do you have?
So it looks like there are two issues that you are having. 1, the brand new coach batteries only have 12 V. A fully charged battery should do better than that! 2. When the alternator is running, you do not think that the coach batteries are being charged.
I would do the followings
0, figure out if your coach batteries is being charged properly by the charger/converter via the shore power. A fully charged battery should be at least 12.6 v. There is the solar charger that is charging them all the time during day time too. If it is not being charged when plugged into shore power, it maybe related to why it is not working when the alternator is working.
1, check the voltage at the start battery to make sure it is close to the alternator voltage.
2, check the voltage at the separator to make sure it is connecting to the coach batteries when voltage is above 13.2 v.
3, disconnect the red wire from the separator to the coach battery terminal, and make sure it is 13.2+ when the alternator is running.
4, figure out if there is any large load on your rig that is preventing you from charging your coach battery.
For my rig, the separator is a Surepower 1315, so it is bi-directional. It will connect the batteries (start/coach) if either one of them is above 13.2 volt. So if you measure 14 volts at the separator start battery terminals, then it should be connected to the coach batteries and start charging them too.
Again, what type of rig do you have?
So it looks like there are two issues that you are having. 1, the brand new coach batteries only have 12 V. A fully charged battery should do better than that! 2. When the alternator is running, you do not think that the coach batteries are being charged.
I would do the followings
0, figure out if your coach batteries is being charged properly by the charger/converter via the shore power. A fully charged battery should be at least 12.6 v. There is the solar charger that is charging them all the time during day time too. If it is not being charged when plugged into shore power, it maybe related to why it is not working when the alternator is working.
1, check the voltage at the start battery to make sure it is close to the alternator voltage.
2, check the voltage at the separator to make sure it is connecting to the coach batteries when voltage is above 13.2 v.
3, disconnect the red wire from the separator to the coach battery terminal, and make sure it is 13.2+ when the alternator is running.
4, figure out if there is any large load on your rig that is preventing you from charging your coach battery.
2000 Concourse dinette, on 1999 6.8L Ford E350 Triton V-10 Chassis
Re: Battery charging
Hello.chin_k wrote: August 6th, 2020, 10:05 pm I see what you are looking for. I missed the part where you said you have new coach batteries. Sorry about that.
For my rig, the separator is a Surepower 1315, so it is bi-directional. It will connect the batteries (start/coach) if either one of them is above 13.2 volt. So if you measure 14 volts at the separator start battery terminals, then it should be connected to the coach batteries and start charging them too.
Again, what type of rig do you have?
So it looks like there are two issues that you are having. 1, the brand new coach batteries only have 12 V. A fully charged battery should do better than that! 2. When the alternator is running, you do not think that the coach batteries are being charged.
I would do the followings
0, figure out if your coach batteries is being charged properly by the charger/converter via the shore power. A fully charged battery should be at least 12.6 v. There is the solar charger that is charging them all the time during day time too. If it is not being charged when plugged into shore power, it maybe related to why it is not working when the alternator is working.
1, check the voltage at the start battery to make sure it is close to the alternator voltage.
2, check the voltage at the separator to make sure it is connecting to the coach batteries when voltage is above 13.2 v.
3, disconnect the red wire from the separator to the coach battery terminal, and make sure it is 13.2+ when the alternator is running.
4, figure out if there is any large load on your rig that is preventing you from charging your coach battery.
My rig is a 2003 Baja. The house batteries show 13 volts when plugged in to
120v power. They just don't seem to be receiving a charge from the alternator.
My rig doesn't have a solar charger. Thanks for your help.
Re: Battery charging
Those are good suggestions, Chin.
Baja, I would do what has been listed, and I'll add a couple more things to consider.
Some voltage issues could be attributed to cabling and connections. I always look for crusty ground connections to the chassis. The factory style is not the best.
Where is the coach battery voltage reading coming from?
What type of batteries do you have? If they're flooded, check the water levels. 12.0V from new batteries is too low. I would check all the connections and do the easy stuff before removing them for testing, or driving to a tester.
Dumb question: are you positive that the batteries are new? Did you buy them? There's typically a date code of some sort directly on the battery. If the previous owner did the batteries right before selling, then maybe they were "correcting" a preexisting problem and they've already been abused. Lots of variables here.
Good luck.
Baja, I would do what has been listed, and I'll add a couple more things to consider.
Some voltage issues could be attributed to cabling and connections. I always look for crusty ground connections to the chassis. The factory style is not the best.
Where is the coach battery voltage reading coming from?
What type of batteries do you have? If they're flooded, check the water levels. 12.0V from new batteries is too low. I would check all the connections and do the easy stuff before removing them for testing, or driving to a tester.
Dumb question: are you positive that the batteries are new? Did you buy them? There's typically a date code of some sort directly on the battery. If the previous owner did the batteries right before selling, then maybe they were "correcting" a preexisting problem and they've already been abused. Lots of variables here.
Good luck.
1994 Premier
-
caconcourse
- Senior Member
- Posts: 510
- Joined: October 31st, 2014, 10:25 pm
Re: Battery charging
One more thing you can try to check the isolator. While the engine is running, press the "Boost" button on the ceiling which will force the isolator switch to close. Measure the battery voltage when the button is pressed and see if it goes up to match the alternator. May need a helper to measure or push the button.
I t may be normal for the isolator to stay open if the house batteries are not low.
I t may be normal for the isolator to stay open if the house batteries are not low.
Clay
2001 Concourse
Santa Barbara, CA
2001 Concourse
Santa Barbara, CA
Re: Battery charging
So I did some more searching today and I'm pretty sure I know
why the batteries were not being charged by the alternator.
I found the battery isolator on the drivers side of the engine
compartment. It has two main terminals. One is a cable coming
from the house batteries to a terminal on the isolator and the
other terminal has a cable going to the vehicle battery. I traced
the cable going to the vehicle battery and found that it was just
tucked away by the battery and not hooked up to the vehicle
battery. So you would think the obvious fix would be to hook up
the cable to the vehicle battery. Just for the hell of it I put my
meter on the cable that wasn't connected and it shows 12 volts
which is coming from the house batteries. Should there be 12 volts
on that cable and is it safe to hook it up to the vehicle battery?
Or is the fact that it has 12 volts on it mean that the isolator is
bad? I have found the problem, just don't know the correct
solution. Trouble shooting D/C isn't my strong point.
Thanks for reading my findings. Steve
why the batteries were not being charged by the alternator.
I found the battery isolator on the drivers side of the engine
compartment. It has two main terminals. One is a cable coming
from the house batteries to a terminal on the isolator and the
other terminal has a cable going to the vehicle battery. I traced
the cable going to the vehicle battery and found that it was just
tucked away by the battery and not hooked up to the vehicle
battery. So you would think the obvious fix would be to hook up
the cable to the vehicle battery. Just for the hell of it I put my
meter on the cable that wasn't connected and it shows 12 volts
which is coming from the house batteries. Should there be 12 volts
on that cable and is it safe to hook it up to the vehicle battery?
Or is the fact that it has 12 volts on it mean that the isolator is
bad? I have found the problem, just don't know the correct
solution. Trouble shooting D/C isn't my strong point.
Thanks for reading my findings. Steve
Re: Battery charging
I was thinking about the same suggestion as Clay's, but I guess you have new development.
What is puzzling is that:
1, your "new" batteries do not hold charge well, if it drop down to 12 V after it is charged by the charger at 13V. Are you rounding the voltage, or it is indeed 12.0 V? Even one of my old, tired batteries that is more than 8 yrs old do better than that! I would make sure they are good while you still have the warranty.
2, if the separator is not connect to the start/chassis battery, then it should only have voltage if the coach batteries is 13.2 v per the specification. This lead me to think that you are not reporting the voltage accurately, or there is some other issue that make the separator connect like that. I assume the reason it only has 12.0 volt on it is not because you have the boost-start button pressed like what Clay suggested.
Anyway, having a live wire loose in the engine compartment is not a good idea particular because this cable is not fused, and the wire is undersized. It may explains why your coach battery is not holding charge because it is constantly drains by this cable? If you touch the cable anywhere on the engine chassis, you should see sparks flying! I would definitely connect it back on the chassis battery positive terminal where it belongs.
When I see a loose wire like that, it always makes me wonder what other surprises you will find. Hopefully after you put the cable back, the issue with both the alternator charging and the low voltage at your coach batteries both disappear.
What is puzzling is that:
1, your "new" batteries do not hold charge well, if it drop down to 12 V after it is charged by the charger at 13V. Are you rounding the voltage, or it is indeed 12.0 V? Even one of my old, tired batteries that is more than 8 yrs old do better than that! I would make sure they are good while you still have the warranty.
2, if the separator is not connect to the start/chassis battery, then it should only have voltage if the coach batteries is 13.2 v per the specification. This lead me to think that you are not reporting the voltage accurately, or there is some other issue that make the separator connect like that. I assume the reason it only has 12.0 volt on it is not because you have the boost-start button pressed like what Clay suggested.
Anyway, having a live wire loose in the engine compartment is not a good idea particular because this cable is not fused, and the wire is undersized. It may explains why your coach battery is not holding charge because it is constantly drains by this cable? If you touch the cable anywhere on the engine chassis, you should see sparks flying! I would definitely connect it back on the chassis battery positive terminal where it belongs.
When I see a loose wire like that, it always makes me wonder what other surprises you will find. Hopefully after you put the cable back, the issue with both the alternator charging and the low voltage at your coach batteries both disappear.
2000 Concourse dinette, on 1999 6.8L Ford E350 Triton V-10 Chassis
Re: Battery charging
It's not protected?! Really? Wow, that's pretty lousy. I don't have any of that stuff in my rig, but I guess I'm not surprised.chin_k wrote: August 7th, 2020, 9:52 pmAnyway, having a live wire loose in the engine compartment is not a good idea particular because this cable is not fused
Simply being disconnected doesn't drain, does it? If it's shorted, sure. But that would be far more severe than the scenario described.chin_k wrote: August 7th, 2020, 9:52 pmIt may explains why your coach battery is not holding charge because it is constantly drains by this cable?
I dunno about that. True, that's where it "belongs", but that doesn't make it a good idea at this stage. It was disconnected for a reason. Maybe a bad reason. Any guesses?chin_k wrote: August 7th, 2020, 9:52 pmI would definitely connect it back on the chassis battery positive terminal where it belongs.
More troubleshooting is required for sure. Puzzling situation.
1994 Premier